Mix Bus Compression Tip: Agree or Disagree?

I know That I’m the new guy here. So slap me down if I get out of hand…
But I guess that I was out of the loop when mixbuss compression became “a thing”. But then again I was out of the loop when mixing became a thing… :slight_smile:
You recorded your basics and scratch tracks, did your overdubs, the producer came in and talked some nonsense and you did you mixdown usually with the band in the room. If your “good” compressor was available, you patched it into your stereo main buss. If you needed to impress someone, you cranked it a bit more and added as much makeup as you could get away with…
Yeah… I know. Times are a changing and such… :slight_smile:
I’m sorta playing here because I use every plugin I could find and have been doing multi and parallel buss compression since I realized that I could have 100 1176s in one session.
But 2 buss compression is not the holy grail or a magic bullet. And agreeing or disagreeing with a technique is time well wasted. Is this particular tip a solid technique… SURE… they all are if it fits your workflow and program material.
So to the OP: Please do not take offense. But try the technique. Try EVERYTHING. If it works for you use it. If not, move on. But keep it in mind because it will probably work on a different session later down the road… :slight_smile:
Please note that I am NOT trying to discourage in any way. I encourage anyone to use your ears, your heart and your soul. Bring your perspective to whatever project you encounter. Pay attention and come up with what YOU like. YOU have to like it first. Then worry about everyone else… :slight_smile: And of course, pay attention to what other folks are doing. Add to your toolbox/arsenal/bag o tricks.
And take this sermon with a grain of whatever since I have time to post to a forum while other folks are tracking and mixing at this very moment… :slight_smile:have fun
rich

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I think we were giving credit to some of our means of achieving the mix, but that’s a good sum up of what has been said. Welcome aboard!

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Solid advice.

There are a million ways to skin a cat, but if we spend your entire life discussing the merits or lack thereof of the plethora of approaches and experimenting with which one is the “best”, we’d never actually get anything done.

I’d really encourage a “just so it” approach: If you hear/read/watch something you think might work for you, just try it and make up your own mind. If it works for you, keep doing it until it doesn’t work any more. Try ridiculous and “wrong” stuff - it’s amazing how often doing stupid stuff pays off, even if only to teach a lesson.

In the end, no one really needs to know how the meal was made, only that it tastes great.

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Yup…
Sometimes we like talking about stuff more than actually doing it. I know I do ( A LOT)
And I guess that’s what we’re doing here… :slight_smile: But it’s all good. Sometime talking and sharing ideas just helps to solidify them in your mind.
have fun
rich

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I never go more than 2 db myself 2.1 or lower

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Everybody wants to be a celebrity chef, but nobody wants to do the dishes…! :smirk:

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I mixed for a LONG time without using 2MIX buss compression (I just wasn’t aware it was a thing), but after a lot of looking around I started experimenting with it after Vance Powell came to the school I was attending and took a session for instruction. We were using an API Vision and he used a buss comp on the master and mixed into it. I’ve been a steady user of an extremely light compression since then, it just makes the entire mix gel together to my ears…of course there are still tracks that demand to have no compression at all. My go-to is about the same as what you stated, 1.5:1 and put gain where I peak on transients around -6 just to give myself some headroom.

If I’m working with a mastering engineer then I’ll usually contact and see what they would prefer…compressed or uncompressed.

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Don’t have it so never used it. I use bx_digital v3 on my 2-bus though. And Slate FG/X - but I usually don’t slam too much compression there anyway.

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I agree, but I think you need to start mixing with the 2 bus compressor already set, and adjust it as you mix the song to keep gain reduction and overall gain. Then it would not add another round of compression.

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While this is not the popular opinion, I am completely against. As I said in a previous post, the life in a recording is in those peaks, why would you want to compress those peaks? How can getting rid of them add “punch” to a recording? Some of the best sounding LP’s and CD’s on the planet were manufactured by a couple of guys that believed compression was the devil and never used it, George Piros, and Barry Diament. If names like Bob Marley, Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, Yes, Genesis, and Guns N’ Roses don’t need compression on their recordings, neither do you. Back in Black and Appetite for Destruction, both original prints (there is only one print for Appetite I believe) were from the original tapes and feature no compression or limiting. You have the second highest selling album in the world with no compression, and the highest selling debut album ever with none as well. And you know what else? They sound amazing. Compression levels should be determined in the mix, I do not think it is ever necessary to limit the sound your audience is hearing. I do not believe that it acts as a gluing agent either, I believe it makes a recording more monolithic and maybe that’s what people are hearing who describe that phenomenon. There’s less variety and flare, but these are just my ears. Take that for what it is, if you believe that it makes the recording sound better, trust your ears before my or anyone else’s word. But also bear in mind, trust your ears before the gear. Less is more when it comes to mastering, a fact that too many people have let slip by them these days in my opinion.

Cheers,
Doubletrackinjive

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I like your post not because I don’t totally disagree with it, but because I think it’s awesome that different people have such different views on this stuff.:+1:

I would say that mix compression isn’t about getting rid of peaks, it’s about controlling them just as you might choose to control any other aspect of your mix. As long as you pick an appropriate attack time, if anything you’re accentuating the peaks and adding punch by letting them through unaltered before the gain reduction kicks in. Of course, you could do this at the individual track level but there’s more than one way to bake a potato.

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This has turned into an excellent discussion. I’m glad I went and retrieved it when I did!

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Yes, excellent discussion.

In my opinion both sides have good points. Maybe it’s a modern trend to do dynamics processing in the 2 bus?? Lot’s of top engineers tell they use 2 bus compression (CLA, Tchad Blake, Andrew Schepps, Dave Pensado). Tchad Blake even uses heavy 2 bus limiting when mixing, as mastering engineer Brian Lucey told (he mastered Black Keys recent albums, as well Arctic Monkeys AM record, all mixed by Blake).

doubletrackinjive cited great engineers that do not use compressors. Warren Huart, who recorded and produced Aerosmith, Fray, Ace Frehley and runs Produce Like a Pro website, doesn’t seems to use 2 bus compressors when mixing ITB as well (but he uses his SSL desk for summing, and maybe uses it’s built in compressor???). The Izotope Mixing Guide (available @ Izotope website) even states that no 2 bus processing should be used!

We could maybe list top engineers known 2 bus processing habits, so we could gather more info on the subject??

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I understand that point of view, and if that’s what you’re hearing, than it’s correct for you. Just to clarify I have no problem with using compression during the mixing stage, but I definitely don’t use as much as other engineers. I just think that all necessary compression can be taken into account before the album is mastered. Others may disagree, but that’s variation that makes people interesting.

Cheers,
Doubletrackinjive

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I would agree with you that over compression is bad. And the fact is that on the mix bus, every tiny move you make affect the whole mix a lot more than anything you do in groups or individual tracks.
But doing it as a top-down approach, I like the fact that if you slap a compressor on your 2-bus from the start, after you’ve done a rough level mix, then you mix into it and it helps because then you don’t have to do too much at the individual tracks level.
At least that’s how it works for me… but as they say, YMMV.

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Amen… no formulas for success…

When it comes down to it (FOR ME) I don’t even think in terms of controlling peaks… or possibly “control” anything. It’s just a final “buff” or polish or finish. SO it’s just a general “sound” at that point. The way I mix, it still sounds good without it. But it sounds better-er with it :slight_smile:

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@ColdRoomStudio so sorry…your question got lost in the mess of madness lol. It’s a UAD plug…I knew you and @ptalbot had some of them, just wondered if used this one :smiley:

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By that logic, then why compress anything at all?

???

I meant in the mixbus!