It’s impossible to judge another persons’ motive unless you can read minds. Boz is correct - listen, take what you want, discard what you don’t - rinse, repeat and move on.
You get better at mixing the same way you get better at anything else (singing, guitar etc): LOTS of practice. There is no getting around it: It takes LOTS of time and LOTS of patience.
When I started out posting my tracks online for review 11 years ago I got plenty of blunt advice. Even now, with 11 years of progress behind me, if I’m brutally honest with myself, I still sometimes feel affronted rather than assisted. It really hurts at times, but when I really analyse the situation, I usually realise the problem is my ego, not theirs’. Often I find, if I take a break, come back to the comments later with a fresh outlook and a clear head, I can find something helpful.
The real secret is to separate the advice from the manner it is given. Just because someone has no tact or interpersonal skills doesn’t mean they don’t have something valuable to say.
Nevertheless I try not to be harsh when I review stuff, while at the same time, trying to be candid and straightforward - it isn’t always an easy line to walk. I’ve generally found people here at IRD try to be fairly polite but direct.
Keep at it @Jon-Jon - You’ve already progressed, and I guarantee you’ll progress more if you can be more circumspect about criticism. That’s been my experience, anyway.
Well if 10 different people have to tell you “how to deal with so and so”…then so and so IS the problem lol. Im always amazed at the length communities go to in order to let people continue being abrasive
one bad apple etc
it would be a lot simpler with a basic “ignore” feature. Other forums have those for a reason
cest la vie
I also found out as a kid that generally if u give in to a bully that they keep on bullying. I had to punch this bigger kid in the face one time but it got the point across
I’ve found that most bullies are just insecure people who are actually longing for respect and dignity. If you treat them with respect and dignity and try to appeal to whatever elevated qualities they may have, they generally respond very well, like anyone who is treated with respect and dignity.
Of course, I’m realistic, and I say most, but not all… I try that path first, because punching someone in the face just leaves you with a sore fist , and it brings you down to their base level of violence. If they insist on continuing with uncouth behavior despite dignified responses, I just leave them be and get on with my life.
+100000!!! What site mods don’t understand is, people like this not only deter the new people, they push the good people away because they don’t want to deal with them.
I had that problem with RR. Granted, no one wants censorship but when the site owner and the mods message you telling you you’re right etc and nothing gets done to the one starting the crap, that’s poor leadership. AND you’ll notice the person always making waves has taken turns fighting with others. Remove the cancer without upsetting the community.
I’m a super MOD at the cakewalk sonar forums. I watched the same 5 dicks wreak havoc until even I stopped posting. Now I just go on and delete posts and ban people so everyone can enjoy the place.
One thing to remember…and I said this to one of the smart ass guys at RR who I wished would have met me somewhere. I swear that’s how pissed I got. But I told him…
There are people behind these screens. I doubt you would say some of the things you say to a man’s face. If you did, you’d be lumped up 24/7. This guy was such a prick, I’m telling you…if he acted in real life like he acted on that forum, he’d never survive. There’s just no reason for it. Get in 5 fights with 5 different people or continue to make the hair on people’s neck stand…you’re outta here. That’s how it should be. I’d expect it if it were me starting the trouble. I’ll never understand why people act like that and why site bosses allow it.
This is a key concept. It’s always been very important to me never to write something on the web that I would not say directly to someone in person. In the chat window I drew the analogy between criticism here and criticism we scientists get in peer review. To be clear, I am not equating music and science; only comparing the process by which critique is given and received.
In the peer review process for journal publications, reviewers can choose whether to identify themselves. Many of my colleagues choose to remain anonymous. However, I got a great piece of advice from a mentor when I was still in grad school, who strongly advised me never to do that, to always identify myself to the authors whose paper I was reviewing. I have done it every single time, and sometimes I have had to give some quite negative reviews that did in fact hurt the feelings of that author.
But in every single instance, the author eventually told me that they really appreciated my candor and that the paper was better in the end for the criticisms I (and the other reviewers) raised, and I’ve never lost a collegial or friendly relationship with anyone in the 30 years I’ve been doing it.
So I’ll strongly agree with both Andrew @ColdRoomStudio and @Danny_Danzi on these points. Even if someone is gruff and terse in how they deliver a critique (and I know in at least one case a gruff-seeming member would in fact say the same things the same way right to ya), it’s almost always meant to be constructive and helpful. To me, that constructive candor is the total strength of BTR and what sets this community apart from all others.
First off, Danny, it’s great to see you on here, and I’m sorry I didn’t mention that before. Second, I agree with everything you say, except I think the guys are doing a pretty good job of playing referee on here in general, so there may be a man behind the curtain working on this trying to keep everyone happy.
Third, music, mixing, and the opinions that go with them, I’m sure in your experience have always been polarized on forums. Maybe we should develop some kind of mix critique that standardizes the comments to a certain extent and leaves a little room for personal commentary at the end, kind of like a mix checklist. When you post on a forum, you kind of automatically go straight to the point you’re trying to get across, and you have to be careful to point out what’s good too, or you’ll come off as being abrupt, and combative. It’s the nature of the beast that in certain musical genres things either suck or they are great. You’re one of the few that can tell someone it sucks without it coming across that way.
Thanks and great to see you also. You were (and still are) one of the coolest dudes I met at RR. Glad you’re here too brother. Yeah, I got no issues with the guys here. I just think sometimes…someone needs to step in and say “hey, so and so…you’ve got into a confrontation with this one, that one this one and that one. We’re seeing a pattern here…maybe you should stop being a Richard Cranium or we have to ask you to leave.”
See what you said above in your last sentence, I thank you for noticing that…but in all fairness, it’s not hard for people to do. They like to flex their muscles. They think it makes them look powerful and others are beneath them. It makes them look foolish. A good teacher is someone that tells you what is wrong without making you feel like crap, teaches you how to fix it, and doesn’t cop an attitude while trying to intimidate you into learning.
When I teach guitar…you get something hard to challenge you, and something fun and exciting to show your friends to keep your morale. If I kept things super hard and theory based all the time, it gets old and you may lose desire. The same if I yell or put you down or even tell you something isn’t right without compassion or an in depth answer. If I don’t have the time to answer in depth like I always do, I don’t answer at all. And I NEVER try to intimidate or share my experiences to deter people.
When I speak of the accomplishments of my life or career, I don’t use them to boast. I mention them at times to let people know "hey, I’m not just a dude sitting behind the screen trying to pull the wool over your eyes…I have actually made incredible money all throughout the music business, and I’m willing to share my knowledge and experience with you for the price of your internet connection, and a “thank you Danny!” You can’t beat that, ya know? So to me, it’s quite simple to deliver helpful advice without making a person feel like “wow, I’m really sorry I posted this now…might as well hang it up…I suck.”
See man, the other side is…our songs are our children. They are pieces of our lives that we are really close to. If I say something about your child in real life, you may tell me off or punch me in da mouff. LOL! Same with our song children. I’m not saying people need to walk on eggshells, but we need to have a certain respect, compassion and almost affectionate approach while still telling it like it is. If I can do it, anyone can. It just takes a little thought in the delivery.
Now granted, I have a few recording students and guitar students that I’ve had to show tough love. But it’s better when you know a person first. You don’t just lash out. I have a 3 strike rule with my students. I have fired quite a few. It’s not right to take their money or their parents money if they are wasting my time. So I do get a little harsh when I need to…but like I say, it’s in person. You see the facial expressions and tone of voice that you don’t sometimes see on here. Add in that people from all over the world are here with different language interpretations and boy…you can sometimes go for a ride. LOL!
, and it brings you down to their base level of violence. If they insist on continuing with uncouth behavior despite dignified responses, I just leave them be and get on with my life.