So is the whole thing with Waves constantly running specials on everything really about advertising? Basically the sale event ceases to mean anything and everyone just accepts that the Mercury Bundle has an actual retail value of $2k?
I really wonder how their model works. They’re not a publicly traded company, but I’d be curious to see what percentage of their cashflow is hardware, vs subscriptions, vs software, vs IP licensing. I have to admit that Waves marketing is outstanding. But at the same time, the stuff they make unique, highly usable, sounds good, and I think their customer service is superb.
So the obvious answer is the Waves plugin is worth what people at large are willing to pay for it. But is it that simple?
Each Waves plugin is worth $29. That’s the only time I (and many others) buy any of them, so that’s what they’re truly worth. The only other price that they post is for those that are not patient enough to wait for them to $29. The “list” price is basically a surcharge for those that need it before they are $29 again. It’s really that simple in my mind.
I called their marketing guys Monday, told the guys my situation and strait up asked them if they could look at their charts and tell me when the last time was the Ambisonics bundle went on sale. They said it never has. I asked them about their intelligent auto mixer plugin (which I think is the best one that’s ever been invented) which is $600 and has also never once gone on sale. When you “W up” (which means pay up to $225 pr year and all updates to all plugins are free) you also get a $225 voucher for new plugins. I tried to buy some of their hardware with it, and they told me I can’t. I can only use it on software, which is pretty funny because besides their Ambisonics bundle, there’s nothing left to buy.
So I was sure as hell not going to pay $400 for that ambisonics bundle if it was going to go on sale for $80 next month, but it won’t. So…I guess I’m stuck with the $400 tab which was what made me scratch my head and go hmmmm…why would every other plugin go on sale but the two I can actually use never do?? Ironic. Don’t ya think?
Oh, and the hilarious thing is that the Waves AI mixing software is incompatible with Pro Tools, Logic, Nuendo, Reaper, Digital Performer, Ableton, Reason, Studio 1, Sonar, Mixcraft and FL studio. lol…just so you know
I bought the Platinum bundle some years ago on sale… since then I’ve bought a LOT of other Waves plugs, all on sale but there were some for more than $29 because they hadn’t started discounting them that low yet. In the $29 era, the most I’ve paid is $39 for the PRS amp sims.
I love Waves, and as long as they continue to put out decent plugs I’ll keep buying them. The WUP annoys me, but it’s a pretty minor gripe.
I think @holster is right though, there’s almost no point in buying a plug at their full price. They always come back down to $29 eventually. Except for what @Jonathan wants though! But that does certainly affect the perceived value. If I’m almost guaranteed I can get it for $29, that’s what it’s worth as a consumer. What it’s worth to Waves is a different story, when you factor in RnD and dev time… but I’m assuming the low prices are meant to drive quantity sales, which probably shakes out the same as the higher prices/lower sales anyways.
Oh interesting!!! So $29 is their magic number? haha…didn’t know that.
Same here. Occasionally they publish some that are not included in Mercury/Abbey Road/SSL, but if they keep creating usable stuff, I’ll keep paying for it too.
Ya know, Waves is the ONE company I don’t mind this with. Part of it is that they don’t dock you $2400 like Avid does if your subscription lapses. So you can literally stop paying for it when you don’t feel you need it anymore, then pick it right back up for the normal price when you do. That way no one gets strong armed into W’UP-ing when they don’t need to. The catch is that if you’re out of date and your plugins bug out because of an operating system or DAW change, you’re screwed unless you pay. But EVEN THEN, they make it so you can roll back to the last revision of the plugins. Like if your V10 plugins won’t load, you can run a quick un-installer and revert back to your v9’s.
The question is what the company is supposed to do if it wants to keep adding plugins to a bundle. Do you stiff the people who paid the same price for it three years ago? And make them re-purchase the plugins? Or do you do what SSL did to their bundles and never update it, thus letting it start to go obsolete on the market? To me, Waves seems to have found a good compromise between staying current, providing a value to the customer, being fair to new and old users, but also keeping their bottom line intact. I probably have a higher opinion of that company than most, but if I were to make a list of all major music gear companies and rank them by customer service, I wouldn’t hesitate to have them in the top 5 with Yamaha and ILIO.
A plug in has to be pretty spectacular to be worth anything to me. So many plugins sound exactly the same to me. I use about 4 plug in compressors, a couple eq’s, 2 reverbs, 1 delay. I own a billion plugins and use only a handful.
A plugin is worth whatever it’s worth to you. If it makes you faster or more valuable to your clients, then it’s worth a lot. If it is just a toy that you are buying because you are bored, it’s probably worth less.
Also, separately, the truth of the matter is that the consumer market is worth way more than the pro market. That’s why everything is on sale all the time. Very few consumers will pay $200 for a plugin. Many will pay $29. The only reason to have a high price tag is to make the consumer market feel like they are getting pro gear.
Something like the ambisonics bundle is not really geared toward consumers. It’s a niche product. Same with the Auto Mixer stuff. It’s designed for people who make income from audio, not for hobbyists, which is why you don’t see them on sale.
This is actually funny for me. A couple of months ago I downloaded the Scheps Omni plugin, and found it wonderful to use. The price tag was $149, and I toyed with the idea of maybe just paying that amount. My good friend told me the $29 rule for Waves plugins, and guess what? Bought it two days ago for $29!
I’ve thought about this and think I’m probably grumbling unnecessarily… My main beefs are what you mentioned about subs lapsing and what I feel is cost vs advancement in the software. I tend to compare Pro Tools to Cubase because those are the two DAW’s I run, and I feel like Cubase has become this juggernaut and Pro Tools has sort of plodded along and added useful things here n’ there.
I do love Pro Tools and will always make sure I have access to it because I’m still the most comfy in it… and may wind up moving to HD eventually depending on hardware decisions. I also recognize that Pro Tools has to cater to much more than just music-based studios, so I’m probably just jumping on the “Damn you, Avid!” bandwagon
I don’t know about that one Big Al, but for less than 2X that price, you can get 6 really decent plugins. On the recommendation of a friend, I got the Manny Marroquin bundle and love it. Just the EQ alone is superb. He basically took his favorite EQs and put them all in one. Each range is an emulation from one of his go-tos. It can be had at everyplugin for about $50…
Yeah. I think these are the two best in vox plugs they make and the only ones that I still use. Not crazy about the Kramer and maserati vocal plugs, and the Manny set doesn’t have any. The greg wells is a bit more modern sounding to me than the cla.
I use the maserati groups plugin for back up vocals, but not the vocal one for leads.
But that does certainly affect the perceived value. If I’m almost guaranteed I can get it for $29, that’s what it’s worth as a consumer. What it’s worth to Waves is a different story, when you factor in RnD and dev time… but I’m assuming the low prices are meant to drive quantity sales, which probably shakes out the same as the higher prices/lower sales anyways.
