Extreme - "Rise" - New or Redux? (Van Halen-ish)

Recording, Mixing and Producing The Producer's Chair
#1

This seems to be the “big new deal”, and of course it’s interesting or I wouldn’t bother you with posting it. :grin: :joy: :smirk:

Extreme - “Rise” (Official Video)
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[Rick Beato]
The Nuno Bettencourt Solo Everyone is Talking About

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I find the “Cross-ish” iconography interesting, suggesting that there’s more to this than the typical Illuminati Satanic music industry mind-warp BS infesting your mind here. There may be a positive message? Maybe. It’s better than the “bank run” fear porn garbage that the Globalist Cult is pushing down your throat anyway. Yeah, the financial system may be collapsing in front of your face, but that’s only because that’s what they want you to believe. Anyway, please “Rise” above it, and be your best self in your best life!

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#2

All I’m hearing in that verse is Stone Temple Pilots, and it kills the song dead for me.
Chorus has a nice hook, then you get sucked straight back into that Scott Weiland, been there done that vocal delivery thing.
Even the solo can’t redeem this one. It’s a thumbs down for me.

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#3

It does have some similarities to “Dead and Bloated” now that you mention it, but is significantly different IMO. Maybe derivative, maybe not. Does it make a new statement of reality, or only re-hash?

#4

Nah mate, not ‘Dead n Bloated’, ‘Silvergun Superman’.

Specimen A:

Specimen B:

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#5

The lyrics seem to say that our new god is nothing more than material possession driven by our desperate need to be seen and famous for at least 15 minutes before we kill ourselves and as many of our fellow citizens in a blaze of misdirected glory.

Seems pretty accurate.

Extreme has always been a very talented band and Nuno is one of my favorite guitarists.
Since he never seems to age, maybe he did sell his soul…

Great song BTW. Body moving rhythm and a typical Nuno solo.

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#6

Ah, that IS pretty interesting indeed!

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#7

I WAS surprised to see Extreme again after so many years … but pleasantly surprised. As with so many song lyrics, the meaning isn’t crystal clear, and now that I think about it … that chorus is reminiscent of Katy Perry or Kesha (even has “Tic toc, tic toc” in the verse lyric).

It does seem to mix fatal attraction with some kind of prophetic message. I’m guessing it might involve politics, in that some are mesmerized by MSM and the narrative of a particular administration that pushes a ‘woke’ agenda while trying to get us vaporized in a WWIII nuclear holocaust. Just my opinion, of course. :wink:

Here are the lyrics, BTW.
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"RISE"

Look around, look around
Look around you
Little town, lost and found
Where we find you
If you stay your decay
Will define you oh

Come along, come along
Come and join us
Take a little walk
In the middle of the madness
Get your mind and your rhyme
And your reason blown

You can feel it
You can taste it
Take a bite of your life
Don’t you waste it
Ride the lightning
Roll the thunder
You’re the chosen one

I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Straight to the top
Gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Then rip you apart
I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Watch you rise, watch you fall
Gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Rise
Up, up, up, up
Rise

Take a bow, take a bow
To the new king
Ever cool is the fool
Never lasting
Wanted dead or alive
Every king must die

Tic toc, tic toc
You’re a time bomb
World is gonna watch
While you have your final meltdown
What you were, what you want
What you are no more

They can feel it
They can taste it
Eat you up, spit you out
Defecated
Boy wonder
Trampled under
You’re the chosen one

Gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Straight to the top
I’m gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Then rip you apart
I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Watch you rise, watch you fall
Gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Up, up, up, up

Want it, got it
Bought it, sold it
Bag it, tag it
Take it, leave it

I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Straight to the top
I’m gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Then rip you apart
I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Watch you rise, watch you fall
Gonna raise you up, up, up, up
Rise
Up, up, up, up

Gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Straight to the top
Gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Then rip you apart
I’m gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Watch you rise, watch you fall
Gonna lift you up, up, up, up
Up, up, up, up

You got what you want
You got what you want, oh yeah
You got what you want
Yeah

https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/extreme/rise.html

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#8

This may not mean anything, but I noticed that Gary is using the inner part of a mic stand in a similar stage presence way to how Freddie Mercury (Queen) did. Though Gary’s is longer (Freudian? :smirk:). Also, Nuno is wearing black finger nail polish like Freddie did in the early days of Queen.

Now if Brian May could reproduce that guitar solo …

#9

Ha, I was just riffing on the Brian May comment, but then this came up around 4:00 in this video:
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Good interview if you have the time. Around 5:30 he describes “half of Led Zeppelin” coming to see his band.

#10

Here’s the actual video of Brian May saying Nuno’s solo in “Get the Funk Out” is “the epitome of what a solo should be on a record”.
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#11

Actually a little surprised at the gushing reactions over this song and solo. The song is generally forgettable. The solo, while cool, is nothing that special. Van Halen-esque start, the freeform middle and then that crazy muted picking pattern section. Are any of those things bad? Nope. Can you hum it back? Probably not.

The guitarist in me thinks the solo very cool and that Nuno is an incredible talent. His style and technique are amazing. I just don’t understand the outpouring of praise for this particular song and solo. Is it desperation for a current guitar hero? I don’t know.

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#12

Ha, I hadn’t thought about it that way, so thanks for pointing it out. Yeah, maybe the shiny new object to take my mind off of watching most of the world and civilization descend into a big steaming pile of dog poop. :poop:

It was Rick Beato’s enthusiasm that brought it to my attention (see video in OP). I do think the solo is interesting, especially his phrasing patterns in Drop-D tuning. Rick says its a D-minor scale IIRC. As with a lot of songs, I’d like to know much more about what inspired it and what the lyrical meaning is in more detail. I don’t really think we excessively fawned over it though, just exploring something new. And Terry didn’t really care for it at all, so the admiration wasn’t unanimous.

Nuno seems like a cool guy, and a hell of a guitar player. Could he hold down guitar hero status for a period of time? Maybe. We lost Eddie, so there’s that. But then again we got Wolfgang stepping into his own with an album and tour. I guess for me, music is most meaningful when there’s something to get excited about … otherwise, why spend the time on something that doesn’t bring us joy?

#13

I didn’t mean the ‘gushing’ over it here at IRD… but there has been alot of noise generated over this piece online and I’m just a little surprised by it. I actually started watching the video and it just didn’t grab me at all, so I stopped before I even got to hear the solo. It was Rick Beato’s video that got me to watch the whole thing. By the end, the guitar-nerd in me thought the solo somewhat redeemed a lackluster song… and while the solo was executed with beautiful, technical precision, it didn’t seem memorable and the song on the whole just didn’t move me in any way. In contrast, I can still playback the entire ‘Tornado of Souls’ solo in my head, 33 years after it was written.

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#14

Oh OK. Yeah, the online stuff (including Rick) makes it sound like a big deal. And hey, I got caught up in the buzz too.

I guess it either grabs someone or it doesn’t. It may not be a song that wins a Grammy or anything, but it at least seems like some kind of historical marker in their career. The video helps make the song seem cooler than it actually is, perhaps. It’s good enough that I’d add it to “Kid Ego” and “Get The Funk Out” in a playlist.

#15

@skua I’m so glad I read your post before I gave my take. I feel the exact same way. I actually think the song sucks as much as it pains me to say it being a total Nuno fan. I love the solo but the song did nothing for me at all.

I think the problem with older bands coming back is they are trying to be more “now” instead of doing what they do that got them into the hearts of fans.

Sure, they’re going to be repetitive but that’s the beauty for me. Def Lep puts out the same type of album all the time. AcDc…same thing. I don’t want to hear any of those bands trying to be like the new bands. People expect what got those bands noticed. Granted, most artists write for themselves but if you have fans and are selling product worldwide and people are digging you, you HAVE to keep them in mind.

If artists want to show growth and evolution, try it on a song or two to see how it works. If we try to redefine the face of music by way of overload, it’s not gonna work.

Extreme isn’t gonna gain the youth of today nor will they gain the 25 to 30 fan base. So you cater to who and what you’ve created and give the people what they are expecting with a twist of evolution.

I put out a new album called Tribulations last September worldwide with a label. It’s got the melodic rock people were expecting on it but it also has a bit of a modern feel production wise and is up close and personal without loads of production hiding things. I have a small fan base and I have to keep them without trying to be new for the sake of. I am what I am and am the product of my influences.

I feel this is where some of the older bands coming back are losing their way. It’s not about putting out the same album over and over. It’s about doing what you do without trying to keep up with anything or anyone. Evolve in moderation but always give the people what made them love you from the start.

It’s like Dream Theater. After Images and Words, they got so wank fested the hooks just weren’t there anymore. Images and Words was what sold me on that band. The perfect mix of hooks, prog, instrumentation, everything. Now I can’t listen for more than 10 minutes without getting a headache from all the time changes and jacked up parts.

Sometimes basic music with all the right stuff is enough. Bands who have gained an identity…that there is success and something we all wish we could achieve. Just my 02. :slight_smile:

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#16

Thanks for weighing in on this Danny!

I noticed with this song that since I loved Extreme way back, like “Kid Ego” and “Get The Funk Out”, and then heard almost nothing from them for years, it filled a void and seemed relevant. Of course there was that Gary Cherone with Van Halen fiasco (?), but that was over 25 years ago. I have seen Nuno pop up here and there in guest appearances and guest solos perhaps, and interviews. They probably did several, or many, albums in that time, but nothing came on my radar.

The only “now” thing that I noticed, after several listens, is the chorus seems to somewhat replicate pop songs, like maybe Kesha or Katy Perry. I didn’t even notice that at first though, I thought it was cool. And it still doesn’t bother me, just something I noticed.

I did find Terry’s observation (Post #3) interesting, about the STP song verse similarity, and I wondered if they did that on purpose, as a tip of the hat, or completely coincidence, or a ripoff and copyright violation.

I think AC/DC navigated that really well. Some people say they always sound the same, the same formula over and over. But I think they did more what you describe; evolving in moderation and always sticking to the basics. They kept the elements that worked, but always managed to subtly innovate or change something, or always make a new song fresh and different somehow. I think you have to be a hardcore AC/DC fan to really perceive that, it’s not going to be obvious from casual observance of radio hits. There was the ‘pre’ “Highway to Hell” sound, then “Highway to Hell” with its own sound, then “Back in Black” (Bon passed, Brian in) with quite a new sound, and other twists including “Black Ice” in 2008. Some of that may have been different producers too (i.e. Mutt Lange).

Even “For Those About To Rock …” changed the sound from the previous “Back in Black” quite a bit.

I think there’s a reason they’re one of the most famous and best selling bands on the planet. If it works, don’t fix it.

I love AC/DC, and I’ll probably listen to them until the day I die. Hopefully though, on that day, I don’t hear “Hell’s Bells” :grimacing:.

Just my $.05 (figuring in inflation, ya know :slightly_smiling_face:).

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#17

If you’re making bank, why would anyone want to evolve as a musician ?

My favorite groups are ones that are willing to change up their music as they mature as human beings, instead of having to cater to fans who freak out when the musicians dare do something different.

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#18

Many artists have certainly succumbed to that, for various reasons. I’ve always felt that there’s a “money vs. integrity” issue in the music industry. And that the purposeful “commercialization” of music, especially as urged on by record companies (for more profits :moneybag:), has destroyed many artistic careers. The irony, though (IMO), is that if you’re not evolving … then eventually the fans and money dries up, and the career plummets.

My counterpoint would be that AC/DC never really seemed to suffer from that. I’m not saying it didn’t have an influence on them, just that they were able to navigate it successfully over a very long career. More on that below.

While I would generally agree with the points you have made, it seems like a very black-and-white description, a dichotomy, that it has to be either one way or the other. I think the actuality is really much more complex and nuanced; we’re talking about a collection of creative people focused on a goal with numerous other factors involved (including audience). I think it’s obvious that people and artists need to evolve to remain relevant, but yet if they don’t have a ‘core’, a foundation, that they’re not willing to compromise - they’ll likely get lost along the way. I think that’s why some in the music business reach a point where they resolve to “get back to their roots”, as they lost their footing and their fan base.

I’ve heard it said that a great song combines both the old (familiar) and the new (novelty/innovation). People instinctively look for familiar patterns and sounds that represent music to them. With musical genres, and specific bands, you get into the territory of ‘formulization’ - a winning formula. But the audience typically does not want just the same-old same-old either, they want to hear the music going somewhere, even if that freshness is somewhat illusory.

Some bands and artists evolve within their defined wheelhouse, as I think AC/DC has. Others find that they have to make broader adjustments in style and content in order to maintain their own sensibilities as well as fan interest. I think it also matters if the artists’ style and audience is oriented toward Rock/Metal, or dance music, or love songs, or Pop/Jazz/Country/Classical. These can represent different aspects of human inclination which have different expectations and definitions of “art”. The “keg party” vs. the “wine-and-cheese party”, for instance :slightly_smiling_face:.

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#19

all things aside, that was indeed a killer solo! It seems everyone is talking about it…and i hear it for the first time lol. I am getting out of touch after joining the dark side!

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#20

I’m glad you enjoyed it!

Maybe come back to the light side? :slightly_smiling_face: :innocent: The dark side (Globalist Cabal) is slowly getting eliminated from what I understand … not much future there.
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