Down The Stem Separation Rabbit Hole And The Unplanned Song Rennovation Journey 24 Yrs Later

One of things I love most about music creation is the unexpected avenues you can find yourself heading down, whether that be on a solo journey or a collaboration, and this little project I’m currently playing around with is no exception.
I’d just recently been made aware that Image-Line had released a beta version (21.1.99) of FL Studio, and contained with that version is the ability to separate a stereo mix into individual ‘stems’. In the case of FL Studio it’s possible to separate into 4 groups of vocals, bass, drums and instrument tracks/stems.

Having had a bit of previous experience playing around with these types of tools (mainly Rip-X), I was acutely aware of the limitations surrounding this technology, so with that in mind, in an effort to give this a thorough workout right from the get go, I needed the crappiest piece of audio I could find to throw at this thing, and that’s where a song (Primary Infection) off my old bands first album written way back in 1999 came into the picture.
I’m (naively) thinking in the back of my mind, if by some miracle this separation procedure does a reasonable enough job of our shitty recording maybe there’s some way I can rework the production and attempt to make it sound a little less err… shitty.
Having consequently put the bands master cd’s in a “safe place”, (never to be found again) and no ability to rip an uncompressed file to work with, the only source files I had available were 128k mp3’s so I was instantly starting on the back foot, and quietly knew there was little or no chance of ending up with anything remotely usable, which ultimately turned out to be the case.

‘Primary Infection’, original 1999 recording. (Warning, It’s really, really bad haha)

FL Studio Separated ‘Primary Infection’ stems, snippets:

Drums:

Bass:

Instruments:

Vocals:

By comparison here’s an uncompressed .wav file of Alice in Chains ‘Would’. While the final separations are a long way off perfect with a lot of audible artifacts (e.g If you listen to the guitar track you can hear the level ducking at the exact moment a snare hit would be occurring) I think it demonstrates that the quality input source material is paramount in achieving a decent sounding stem.

Drums:

Bass:

Instruments:

Vocals:

So after being a little disappointed, but not really surprised at the results of extracting the stems from our old metal tune, I ended up jumping in feet first and decided to re-record my guitars, as well as add a few new parts, which then lead me to hiring a drummer to completely redo the drums, which he managed to play exactly over top of our old “off-grid” un quantized original recording, amazing.
Side note:
One very handy aspect of extracting stems from a stereo recording is the ability to learn and work out certain parts that might otherwise be buried or obscured within the mix.
So I was able to pretty well figure out the basslines and have since rehired a dude I used on my last song to lay down some beautiful fresh bass tracks (still waiting on those).
It looks like I’ve also got the original singer back on board to redo his Cookie Monster parts as well so it looks like it’s going to be a top to bottom rebirth of an old track written as kids all those years ago.

This is the current mix version I’m at now with brand new guitar tracks, brand new live drum tracks, my crappy midi bass reference (soon to be replaced) and the original 1999 vocals (soon to be replaced).

It really does go to show how a poorly performed and produced song can sound sooo bad, and yet that exact same song with a little bit of reworking and some extra knowledge gained over 24 years can be transformed into something pretty cool.
Will have to continue this over on the ‘Bash This Recording’ page once all the elements come in.
Cheers.

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That’s pretty cool @terryhesticles ; might not work so great for production but for learning tunes off a mixed track? I just think of all the hours trying to hear parts off of a cassette or whatever. Kids today just have it too easy! :rofl:

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I think for the remix dudes it’s going to be a pretty amazing tool in the toolkit, but yeah, as far as trying to salvage a poor recording not so much, I agree.

100%

Not to sound like THAT old dude, but they really don’t know how lucky they’ve got it. How fucking great it would have been to have the digital tools and resources we have available now back in the day.
It’s not fair! :grin:

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[quote=“terryhesticles, post:1, topic:6627”]
I’d just recently been made aware that Image-Line had released a beta version (21.1.99) of FL Studio, and contained with that version is the ability to separate a stereo mix into individual ‘stems
[/quote]You mentioned getting old, well that beta version image line thangy wasn’t at all familiar to me. ha ha

Mornin dude. I just got home after a 5 day visit with my oldest daughter. Of course I didn’t bring head phones.
Loved that deep throat expression right away. Intro a bit too long for me before the first vox. Repeat on that same riff? My fav was at I think 1:07. The sound and vibe there was very cool.
sounds like you put a lot of work into this resurrection. All that is important here is the journey and if it was fun for you. Might not hit the billboard top 100, but , at least for me it was a fun ride.
metal testicles…oh yeah

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Hey there Paul, welcome back after your trip. I guess if you’re not an FL Studio user it’s probably understandable that you wouldn’t be aware of this, and without a license to unlock the beta version it’s probably irrelevant to a great many people.

Being barely 20 years old when I wrote this one, it’s quite naive in it’s composition/arrangement and yes, does feel unnecessarily long-winded in parts, I agree.
I have been going back and forth with my buddy who originally “sang” this, and we’re thinking about adding a few more vocal parts to fill out those meandering sections, and i may even do some judicious editing/chopping to attempt to tighten things up once all the elements come in.

Haha, yeah you’d be hard pressed to find this one on the top 1,000,000 to be perfectly honest.
As you say, it’s really more about the journey, and the fun of rediscovering and resurrecting something from your past.
Would be really nice to just have ONE tune from that old band with a production that actually sounds listenable. that’s the simple goal.
Cheers mate.

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I did most of my composing/recording in the mid-80’s, on a Fostex X-15 cassette 4-track recording machine. It was pretty basic, but it gave me a basic education on recording methods (even if just the X-15 manual). All the new tools are great, but haven’t encouraged me to reach those heights (for the most part). Just saying. It’s all about the inspiration and motivation.

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Whoops, would this be considered a “late reply” :crazy_face: Hell yeah, Fostex 4 track was my very first introduction into the recording/mixing world.
The Fostex 260, God it sounded terrible…but so did we :grin:

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Hi guy. Great to see your kitty pop up on my morning screen. You are so thorough in your music process. I applaud you for that. I am a stumbler bumbler crude fumbler. ha ha I don’t understand any of that. Just my guitars. Sorry I can’t comment. At age 75 one doesn’t learn anymore. henceforth, I am putting together a song called dive that has taken me a month and I don’t even like it. So good you stopped in.
Sincerely Paul

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That looks a couple generations beyond mine, see pic below. I got one of the first models on the market I think. I read about it in a music magazine, bands started using them to write songs on the road. I believe it was 1983. I built a primitive recording studio around it, without knowing much of what I was doing, but I learned a lot and learned by doing. Had a blast with it. Now I have 100 times more gear and capability (relatively speaking) but it’s not as much fun as struggling to lay down a song all evening on the Flintstones home studio. :slightly_smiling_face:

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Thorough in being completely useless :smile: I literally haven’t even picked up a guitar this year I’ve been so slammed with the day job, hence the reason you don’t see me round too much. It was only the fact that I busted my hand that gave me a little downtime/breathing room and the opportunity to pop in. Good to catch up man :+1:

Oh wow yeah, that’s a bit before the 260 for sure. Like you say, freakin’ perfect for laying down ideas on the go.

There’s something to be said for throwing yourself in at the deep end and getting your hands dirty with a bit of real analog equipment, and all the pitfalls that come with it. Not sure if i miss the days of having to bounce tracks just to make room for vocals etc and tape-stretching but it was all a great learning experience, no doubt about that. Kids don’t know how lucky they are these days, insert bitter old man voice here grumble grumble :grinning:

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